Feature Request: Separate Node Editing Tools by Operation Class
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@jpsimmons Would there be a need to swap between these tools frequently?
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I personally am of the opinion that a smaller number of more flexible tools is generally better than a larger number of single-purpose ones.
Final Cut Pro 7 had around 16 tools in its toolbar. Final Cut Pro X can do essentially the same things with only seven (three of which I personally think they could easily still eliminate), and it provides a much better working experience. Davinci Resolve does again essentially the same things with only three tools (one of which I still consider superfluous and never really use as the same thing can be done without it, showing that only two are really necessary for a video editor).
As @vectorstyler hinted at, you would be switching tools left and right with a setup like the one you are proposing, which is a waste of time.
If there a specific issue you are having between two functions of the tool so that we could look at ways to improve the existing tool?
One of my biggest complaints about VectorStyler is that there are too many superfluous tools already that could easily be consolidated into a smaller number of more flexible ones.
For example, do we really need a zillion effect, distortion and warp tools that apply individual distortion and warp effects rather than one generic reshaping tool which lets you pick an effect, distortion or warp type as a mode of the tool?
Each such tool has a distinct icon to learn. Even someone who uses it day in and day out probably has to spend a lot more brain power on trying to identify the tool they want among the array of tools available than they would with one such tool that then lets them pick the specific effect from a separate list which can be organized more meaningfully than is feasible with tools on a customizable toolbar.
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@fde101 said in Feature Request: Separate Node Editing Tools by Operation Class:
If there a specific issue you are having between two functions of the tool so that we could look at ways to improve the existing tool?
When I select a handle to resize a line, for example, I have to be extremely careful to keep it from converting the whole thing to a Bezier curve. I know, I can convert it back, and hopefully not have messed something else up, but this is something Adobe Illustrator did in 1988: black arrow means select the object, white arrow means select the handle, split tool means convert it to a Bezier. I never got confused.
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@VectorStyler I do. Right now, I have a rectangle that I want to resize by making it wider. The standard way of doing that is to use the tranform tool, which has the unfortunate side effect that it can only scale, not simply translate. Using the node tool can do many things: insert a new node because I clicked something wrong, convert to a Bezier because I dragged something wrong.
Mathematically, I want to translate the selected points. Rescaling is an affine transformation. Converting to a Bezier is a topology change. If I could simply say that I wanted to translate, we'd be done.
As a percentage of actions, I would translate probably 80% of the time, affine transform something 18% of the time, and, rarely ever convert a line to a curve or the other way around.
I would say that, no, I wouldn't frequently move between them-mostly, I'd do translations and, less often, affine transformations.
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@fde101 said in Feature Request: Separate Node Editing Tools by Operation Class:
One of my biggest complaints about VectorStyler is that there are too many superfluous tools already that could easily be consolidated into a smaller number of more flexible ones.
Customize toolboxes is one of the best features that VS has-and it's portable in a config file. Simply don't have the ones in your toolbox that you don't use.
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@jpsimmons said in Feature Request: Separate Node Editing Tools by Operation Class:
Customize toolboxes is one of the best features that VS has-and it's portable in a config file. Simply don't have the ones in your toolbox that you don't use.
Sure, and that is great when the tools you want exist and you can rely on the toolbox to stay customized as new versions come out so that you aren't spending lots of time redoing your customizations, etc. It becomes "lots of time" when there are zillions of them to remove.
Incidentally, nearly everything that can be done using those tools can also be accessed using the related panels (from the Window menu) and I normally find that much more usable than sifting through any of those tools in the toolbox.
@jpsimmons said in Feature Request: Separate Node Editing Tools by Operation Class:
@VectorStyler I do. Right now, I have a rectangle that I want to resize by making it wider. The standard way of doing that is to use the tranform tool, which has the unfortunate side effect that it can only scale, not simply translate. Using the node tool can do many things: insert a new node because I clicked something wrong, convert to a Bezier because I dragged something wrong.
You can absolutely scale using the transform tool. To make a rectangle wider drag the side handle (not a corner handle).
If you are having difficulty grabbing the handles accurately you can make the handles bigger (under Settings/Preferences -> Path Editor try adjusting Editor Node Scaling - you can make them obnoxiously large if it helps).
I have no difficulty using the default handles accurately using my Wacom tablet in trackpad mode (fingers on tablet), but I do sometimes find it harder when using the pen. I am guessing you are using a pen based on some of what you are describing, and I suspect larger handles would make that easier.
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Incidentally, there are already dedicated Move, Scale, Rotate and Skew tools that work on nodes; they are hiding behind the Collider tool on the default toolbox configuration.
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@fde101 said in Feature Request: Separate Node Editing Tools by Operation Class:
Sure, and that is great when the tools you want exist and you can rely on the toolbox to stay customized as new versions come out so that you aren't spending lots of time redoing your customizations, etc. It becomes "lots of time" when there are zillions of them to remove.
Don't think I don't appreciate that. And the fact that I can move the ~/Library customizations when I move to a new machine.
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@fde101 said in Feature Request: Separate Node Editing Tools by Operation Class:
You can absolutely scale using the transform tool. To make a rectangle wider drag the side handle (not a corner handle).
Yes, but it scales the widths of lines, too. You can set it so it doesn't, but I have to root around for it and most of the time I can't remember. That doesn't stay done.
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@fde101 said in Feature Request: Separate Node Editing Tools by Operation Class:
If you are having difficulty grabbing the handles accurately you can make the handles bigger (under Settings/Preferences -> Path Editor try adjusting Editor Node Scaling - you can make them obnoxiously large if it helps).
Not the problem. If I select one handle and move the mouse a bit wrong, it converts the line to a Bezier. If I select one handle and need to select another clear on the other side of the graphic, zooming out, then zooming back in on the other handle drops the original. Other ways exist for handles to not stay selected.
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@fde101 said in Feature Request: Separate Node Editing Tools by Operation Class:
I am guessing you are using a pen based on some of what you are describing, and I suspect larger handles would make that easier.
Trackpad.
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@fde101 said in Feature Request: Separate Node Editing Tools by Operation Class:
Incidentally, there are already dedicated Move, Scale, Rotate and Skew tools that work on nodes; they are hiding behind the Collider tool on the default toolbox configuration.
I have never been able to figure out what a collider is. If I selected 3 of 10 handles of a graphic and wanted to translate just those 3, you say I can do it with this Collider tool trick?
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@fde101 Not actually asking for more functionality. Just to partition the functionality of the node tool into several based on the class of change they make. Like Illustrator's black arrow (select) and black arrow with a little + (add node), etc. I could put them "behind" the collider tool in the toolbox and select the functionality I'm looking to use without fear that the node tool will misread my intent.
