Non-destructiveness vs new (visible) reality
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I may have asked this before in some way but I've lost track.
Is there, or is it possible to create a global option that shows scaled/transformed objects and text after transformation the new (visible) specifications?
For example
- Rectangle size 10x10 scaled 50% becomes rectangle 5x5 (instead of 10x10x50%)
- Text 24pt (grouped) scaled 50% becomes text 12pt (instead of 24ptx50%)
- Line after rotation 10 degrees is a new zero rotation (rotation 10 degrees)
I know non-destructiveness is a high priority for VS but the design process is a deconstructive activity by definition. It is difficult to continue developing in a non-destructive environment due to the accumulation of old values.
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@Ayo said in Non-destructiveness vs new (visible) reality:
Rectangle size 10x10 scaled 50% becomes rectangle 5x5 (instead of 10x10x50%)
This should work with the transform panel: the width/height should be a scaled one.
Also: when doing a simple scaling on a rectangle (with the transform tool), it should adjust the rectangle parameters, instead of adding a non-destructive scaling (Settings -> Editing -> Direct Shape Transformation should be checked)Text 24pt (grouped) scaled 50% becomes text 12pt (instead of 24ptx50%)
This is problematic, as it is not possible to "flatten" transforms into the text without converting to curves.
But again, basic scaling (see above) should scale the text attributes. Also: when inside a group, the transform is always nondestructive, but the panels should contain the scaled sizes.Line after rotation 10 degrees is a new zero rotation (rotation 10 degrees)
This needs an extra convert to curve, to have the angle zeroed in the transform panel.
The line (as a shape) angle will always show the current angle. -
@VectorStyler
Thanks for your answerEven with "Direct Shape Transformation" checked the scaling factor 50% remains in the readout. For objects like shapes and lines the "reset" button works as a "flatten" solution for scaling and rotation etc. (cumbersome, you have to do this all the time and not forget). "Reset" for text however does not work. Scaling does go back to 100% but the point size remains 24 despite the fact that I now really have a 12 point size on my screen. I want to nail that a new reality!
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@Ayo said in Non-destructiveness vs new (visible) reality:
Even with "Direct Shape Transformation" checked the scaling factor 50% remains in the readout
This depends on the shape type also, but in case of rectangles it should stay 100%:
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@Ayo This is what I get for text: https://share.cleanshot.com/dGSF9bmr
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Yes ok... but
Scaling rectangle
That works manually but what if I want to enter the scaling factor numerically?Scaling text 1
In a group (which is necessary for text frame scaling) this does not work. Get 50% readoutScaling text 2
Works for point size as long as it stays in a group but what if I ungroup it again I get 24pt readout again -
@Ayo said in Non-destructiveness vs new (visible) reality:
Scaling rectangle
That works manually but what if I want to enter the scaling factor numerically?yes, this will create a non-destructive scaling, which allows for the editing of the scaling factor.
Scaling text 1
In a group (which is necessary for text frame scaling) this does not work. Get 50% readoutI will test with text frames more.
Scaling text 2
Works for point size as long as it stays in a group but what if I ungroup it again I get 24pt readout againI will also test this.
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@VectorStyler
Thanks for the answers but not a solution for me yet. In summary the feature request remains very simple.
A global setting/option toggle, for both manual and numerical editing, that asks:Transformations: destructive or non-destructive.
Non-destructive > keep the initial original spec values
Destructive > gives new spec values after transformationAlthough the feature request is very simple in words, I guess that realisation is very difficult because it looks like VS is built entirely around the non-destructiveness concept.
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@Ayo said in Non-destructiveness vs new (visible) reality:
Destructive > gives new spec values after transformation
Question: what will be shown in the transform panel, after the user confirms a 50% scaling?
And what is shown after the user selects an other object? -
This...
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@Ayo said in Non-destructiveness vs new (visible) reality:
Is there, or is it possible to create a global option that shows scaled/transformed objects and text after transformation the new (visible) specifications?
Another example I've come across that may illustrate my problem well ...
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@Ayo In this case, you need to convert to curves first.
I can try to find a solution for rounding of scaled objects, but it will not work well for other than rectangular shapes. -
Whats curious to me if i do that transformation
with "Object > Transform > Transform" the Corner
stay roundWin 11
CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 9600X, 6-core.
GPU: Nvidia Geforce RTX 5070. -
@Subpath said in Non-destructiveness vs new (visible) reality:
curious
Indeed! Good research. Nice!
I like the behavior of the "Object > Transform Panel" better than the "Window > Transform Panel" It's just a pity that the "Window > Transform Panel" doesn't work as a side panel and is not dockable.
What is the difference according to the developer and aren't the two panels confusing?
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@Subpath In some cases, when the parametric shape attributes can be changes then the corner can stay round after scaling.
In VS, the corner is a shape attribute and it is applied before effects or transforms.
This causes the corner scaling when scaling a shape (in some cases). -
@VectorStyler
"I in some cases" is quite vague if I may say so... -
@Ayo Yes, it depends if we are scaling it with the transform tool, or transform panel.
Also: it can be changed with a settings. -
@VectorStyler
Euh, send me on a wild goose chase -
@Ayo said in Non-destructiveness vs new (visible) reality:
aren't the two panels confusing
Not in my point of view, because the "Object > Transform > Transform"
Panel offers more options and the other Transform panel are
for more simple transformations. -
@Subpath
I am not specifically concerned with more or less functionality, but with the difference in behavior with the same functionality.
